national parks and disc golf

[stirfry]

i just got back from a new hampshire roadtrip. no courses in the norhtern end of it. so i gotsto thinkin. we need some dg players out thee that are also grant writers. Imagine if, the national park service adopted a disc golf program . a course in every national park. imagine a tee shot from high atop mt. washington or playing the knife edge on katahdin? So, what's the appalchian trail...1800 miles...that works out to 100 miles of smiles between holes so grant writers now is your chance to shine. we could make ourselves a non-profit group, called the frisbeetarians of course, with a mission to spread the word of disc golf, through courses built in every national park!

[kurt]

this might come into conflict with why the national parks were established in the first palce (preservation versus conservation) (muir and pinchot) i grew up on the southern end (begining to us) of the AT and now live in Vt with the AT about 10 miles away and i have thought about how cool it would be to play and hike the entire AT. let's say with a ching or something liteweight that your hiking partner could take ahead and set up then you shoot at it and then you switch positions. i think disc golf would fit in really well at interstate rest areas you know a small 9hole and sale discs at the concessions.

[Rick Hobbs]

The land in northern NH to which you refer is National Forest, not National Park. Acadia in Maine is a National Park.
A National Forest can be used for recreation and certain industries, such as logging which is the case in the White Mountain National Forest. A National Park is a place where no industry except for tourism is allowed.
I don't think DG is compatible with the Appalachian trail or other hiking trails. The whole idea of hiking and backpacking is to "get away from it all".
However, there are several campgrounds in the National Forests and Parks that may have sufficient room for a course. I'm not sure what the policies and regulations would be regarding disc golf, but one of the campgrounds I've stayed at has a small field that can be used for playing catch, softball, or other outdoor games. I'm not advocating this location as a DG course (which is why I won't mention the name of the campground), but other campgrounds or recreation areas might be possible locations.
I feel your pain regarding the lack of courses in northern NH. I'm from Massachusetts, but I frequently visit the Granite State for other forms of recreation, so I wouldn't mind seeing a few more courses there.

[Chuck Kennedy]

I believe the extension of the AT might go right thru our new National Disc Golf Center in Augusta. The trail runs right thru the new courses but I'm blanking on the name they called it right now. Begins with a B like Bartram or Bertram.

[discglfr05]

this might come into conflict with why the national parks were established in the first palce (preservation versus conservation)

I disagree...I've been to many national parks (not nat'l forests) where mountain biking and hiking are major recreational activities and a common theme amongst a majority of national parks...disc golf is on the same level as those activities...actually more passive than mountain biking and probably less intrusive..nothing against mtn biking...I love it. I don't see how DG would be considered any more or less detrimental or in conflict with the nat'l parks mission than other activities like hiking or biking.

[Ryan Turncliff]

Two more caveats to work around:
1) entrance fees- with a few exceptions, you usually have to pay to enter a National park proper (though at Acadia this isn't entirely true). Not that I'm against pay-to-play, but this might be a tough sell.
2) While hiking and Mt. Biking may 'impact' the land to the same extent as disc golfers, the 'leave no trace' policies of both National Parks and National Forests might argue against metal baskets scattered around the parks/forests.

THAT said: there are quite a few ski areas operating w/in the National Forests of New England- you can't say a ski lift isn't obstrusive! I would love to see a couple of ski areas in Northern New Hampshire put in DG courses as another form of recreation. When I brought this to the attention of a couple of areas a couple of years ago, the general feedback was that it would cost to much to maintain (landscaping) vs. profits.

[Dave McHale]

"leave no trace" also means you wont be putting any tees out in the grass - we had the issue of aesthetics at Wickham because of the dirt patches occuring on all of the field teepads. That was the reason the crumb rubber was tried, and why we're getting the flypads now since they're much more pleasing to look at than dirt. I think if an institution such as the nat'l parks service is concerned with impact, tees are more of a concern than planting baskets.

Not to say the sport overall isn't low-impact on the environment, but the tee areas really do take a beating.

[discglfr05]

While hiking and Mt. Biking may 'impact' the land to the same extent as disc golfers, the 'leave no trace' policies of both National Parks and National Forests might argue against metal baskets scattered around the parks/forests.

Chances are that if a course were to be planned in a national park/forest setting it would be in an area that is (1) underutilized and/or (2) prone to illegal activity such as ATV use or illegal dumping. I'm sure that every national park or forest has some parcel of land that is being used illegally or in a manner not in keeping with park rules and guidelines. It's not like you'd be riding thru the park and seeing metal baskets everywhere..leave no trace policies mostly pertain to trash, not recreational equipment. What category do information kiosks, stationary trail maps, markers, bridges and look out (vista) platforms fall under?...recreation

[Tom]

As much as a shock as this may seem to some people, compared to the activities found at national parks and forests, disc golf is very hostile to the enviroment. The issue is not with leaving baskets or tee pads, it is with the players. Not so much on open holes in fields but on the wooded holes. Playing in the woods is part of what makes disc golf such a great sport. However when a new hole is established in the woods, trees will be cut to thin it out for a fairway of some sort. That will usually lead to more trees being cut to open up more possible shots. To make matters worse, most of the people who play on the course will not be able to land the disc on the fairway on every hole. This leads to people killing more bushes and shrubs when they walk of the trail to get their disc. The parks enfore strict rules to stay on trail when biking or hiking in order to minimize impact, most trails are only a few feet wide. I'm not saying that it cant be done, but they would never allow a course to be established on any of the hiking or biking trails. Many ski resorts operate on land owned by either state or federal government, since this land is already developed, disc golfers must take advantage of this land.

[discglfr05]

To make matters worse, most of the people who play on the course will not be able to land the disc on the fairway on every hole. This leads to people killing more bushes and shrubs when they walk of the trail to get their disc. The parks enfore strict rules to stay on trail when biking or hiking in order to minimize impact, most trails are only a few feet wide. I'm not saying that it cant be done, but they would never allow a course to be established on any of the hiking or biking trails. .

To be honest, you wouldn't want a course to be established on hiking/biking trails, ideally, you'd want it to be in an area where it is not in conflict with other activities, like the one we're planning at Wompatuck. DG courses shouldn't be implemented in pristine areas of the park where scenic value is the main attraction. This is why DG is a natural activity for areas of nat'l parks/forests that are underutilized (but zoned for use) or already damaged by illegal use..DG isn't nearly as destructive as ATV use or dumping. There are many examples of DG courses being implemented in areas of parks that were once badly abused and/or poorly monitored..check out PDGA.com for examples.

[Matt Stroika]

If Franklin Park would have allowed disc golf, maybe there would not be a young woman's burned body discovered there. In the half dozen times I was at Franklin scouting and playing the temporary course set up, I saw illegal activity just about everytime I was out there. I have no doubt that crime would be decreased by having a presence in the park.

Sort of off topic but relevant imo.

[Tom]

Andrew,
I completly agree that new courses work well in underutilized but already damaged areads. I only mentioned the trails because previous posts had mentioned this. Disc Golf in pristine areas found in the national parks/forests would definatly not work well and would anger many people in the hiking/biking community.

[Adam Goodman]

this might come into conflict with why the national parks were established in the first palce (preservation versus conservation) (muir and pinchot) i grew up on the southern end (begining to us) of the AT and now live in Vt with the AT about 10 miles away and i have thought about how cool it would be to play and hike the entire AT. let's say with a ching or something liteweight that your hiking partner could take ahead and set up then you shoot at it and then you switch positions. i think disc golf would fit in really well at interstate rest areas you know a small 9hole and sale discs at the concessions.

Kurt, I've also pondered this idea of hiking and throwing. My idea was slighly different though. I originally thought of this when I lived in CA...I was thinking how I could hike the Pacific Crest Trail from Mexico to Oregon and throw discs. How many shots would it take? This could work on the AT or a portion of the AT also. My idea was not to have someone drag a basket around, but instead make it ONE LONG HOLE!!!! You could make the tee pad the trail head sign at the beginning of the voyage. The basket could either be a nearby basket on a course walkable from whatever trail you were hiking OR your buddy could bring a basket and put it at the end of the trail. The goal would be to keep track of how many shots it took to hike whatever trail you were on. That would be an interesting number. You could even make it a charity event and raise some money. This could even receive some nationwide news coverage and bring attention to disc golf. The main problem I forsee is that it would take FOREVER. Especially when the trail goes around dangerous hilltops, etc. Not to mention looking for your disc, throwing with a pack on, getting out of the schule...all could cause some pretty major problems.

[Craig Cutler]

Charlie and I sometimes do this in Harriman State Park. We also have done this with a mini... It's so fun but becomes exhausting looking for your disc all the time. It really shows how addicted we all are to throwing plastic

[Adam Goodman]

Charlie and I sometimes do this in Harriman State Park. We also have done this with a mini... It's so fun but becomes exhausting looking for your disc all the time. It really shows how addicted we all are to throwing plastic

Craig, Harriman would be a great place to throw some discs. Is there potential there?

DID YOU KNOW...that Harriman has old, abandoned ball golf courses? These cleared areas could provide incredible disc golf terrain...for a temporary course/camping. I doubt they would let us build a permanent one there though.