Let's Talk About "D" Baby

[David Hoey]

Let's talk about all the good things, and the bad things, that go along with picking the perfect distance driver that fits your game. Let's talk about D. Lets talk about it.

Because hey, I’m curious… and there’s no good place here to talk about it.

Screw trying to work around a driver these days... with soo many super-duper-crazy-warp speed drivers with the quickness, which one fits your game the best? We now have everything from the stupid light, crazy understable stuff, to the (“I hate you”) really heavy, overstable stuff.



Let it be known...

How far are you throwing? (I know we can avoid internet distance here right ?)

< 300ft, 300-350, 350-400, 400-450, 450+

How do you throw for distance?

Backhand, Sidearm? With Anny, Hyzer, or (basically) flat?

What disc(s) are working for you?

There are a bunch of subtle differences between many of these really, really fast drivers. The objective is to find the one that compliments your game best. We shouldn't be having to overpower much these days unless its in those rarer cases where you would need to "nut it" as the kids would say. Less Effort = More Control

Also, any additional factors that go into why you're throwing what you're throwing?

[David Hoey]

Me personally, I’ve been narrowing it down especially as of late, but I can never seem to throw the same “D” disc for very long… For me, for years, a Star Wraith (domey, ~171g) gave me dependable D. I’m looking to keep a straight bomb D disc for the holes that necessitate it. I’ll keep the Wraith in there, it’s a great one! But with all this new stuff coming out, I’d like to have a Super D Disc. Well, with all the options to choose from… I’d like to hear what NEFA is doing these days and how y’all are finding how the new discs fly and treat you.

I can personally eclipse 400 with a Pro Destroyer (~169g, ~flat).

I’ve been eyeing the King, Havoc, and Frenzy lately… really fast, with a touch of turn.

Go.

[Keith Morin]

I recently found that I can throw farthest by "discing down" and better yet, I know where that disc is going (roughly). I can throw my 167 GL River 305 feet, legit distance on a soccer field, faster discs like a Wraith fall well short of that white spray paint line for me. Thrown back hand basically flat.

I remember going into Dakai's shop to buy my very first disc, he gave me great advice about throwing slow and learning how to control a disc. Of course I ignored that and went with the disc that had the coolest name, I think a Beast at the time. I forgot where I was going with this, but it took my 5 years of playing 3+ times a week to throw 300 feet.

[Jaxon Sheehy]

i'm just starting my third year- my putting is where i think it should be: decent. but my distance is definitely suspect. when i go to a football field and empty my bag- i usually max out at 290 ft. boo... but lately i've been throwing over 300 on the course with a DX teebird at 171g.

i love the havoc though. it acts like a broken in destroyer for me. but if i'm stepping up to a 400 ft. or longer hole with a lot of space- i go with the teebird. it's dependable and (as mentioned by another NEFA forum dude in a different thread) it tends to still push forward on the fade and pick up good distance all the way through the flight.

oh, and all back-hand for me. i only flick for shorties left to right-

from my experience though, disc selection has a much bigger effect on the flight path and a smaller effect on the distance if i'm throwing full power. but that might just be me.

[Mike Zorovich]

i'm in the 300-350 range and in March i took out all the high speed/wide rimmed drivers. i went back to basics and started throwing my pro Leopard for everything while slowly introducing the two new discs that i've choose to use for distance. i'm presently throwing farther then ever before, and stepping back for a little bit sure helped my form. while i still use my Leo's a lot, the star sidewinder and PD are the disc i use for max d now.

i found the star sidewinder really workable. while i usually just throw it flat and let the disc do the work, by controlling the release angle this disc will hold the line you throw it on. i was also surprised that it preforms good in the wind for an understable disc. i'll use this on straight holes, or par 4's that require two well placed drives to reach the pin. this is also my flick roller disc.

the PD is a hair shorter then my sidewinder but gets there without the high speed turn that the sidewinder has. straight with a dependable fade. i carry three, the C, the P and the S lines. each seems to be it's own disc. the C is my flick disc, the S is my safe hyzer disc and the P is the farthest but has lost some of that LSS. the P is presently in the "sweet spot". i never liked the feel of teebirds, so the PD is as close as i imagine a Teebird will feel.

recently i been field testing a vulcan. and it sure goes pretty far for me. the problem is when it's thrown wrong it's super ugly...i don't see it moving into the bag.

[Paul Sullivan]

Okay hears is my question on the "D" thing......

I try to throw on the local football field once a week because it really helps my game. Depending on the wind speed and direction, I usually throw my selection of drivers in the 325-350 ft range.

What is nice to see is when all my drivers are spread out across the other end zone. wraiths on the right valks in the middle and sidewinders on the left (I'm a lefty backhand 100%)

Lately I have fallen in love with a beat in 170 star TL. The other night for some reason I was ripping it 350+ on a line from goal post to goal post. Minimal wind in my face and I was throwing at 85-95% power. I had 5 or 6 of the best throws ever for sure.

Any body got any ideas why I had this sudden flash of power?? Why the TL ??

I went out and bought another one asap so I can start breaking it in. Looking for anybodys ideas or suggestions

[Karl Molitoris]

Paul,

I few thoughts...

1. I've deduced (via your post) that psychologically you've relegated the TL to "second tier distance (or worse) status" as you didn't include it with the Wraith / Valkyrie / Sidewinder triumvirate. By doing this, when you throw TL, you...
a. treat it like a 3-wood, i.e. "...it's a target club / disc, not meant for max distance..."
b. throw <100% (self professed)
c. relax the arm / body...and relaxed muscles fire faster than tense ones (thus yielding more speed)
d. probably are "in sync" more (more efficient use of levers), and
...throw further!

And it's not the disc (if you chose a Teebird, Surge SS, etc., these too would probably go that far), it's the thrower!

The key here is to "fake out" yourself into thinking you're NOT going for max distance (with the Wraith, et al) when you in fact are!! Not an easy thing to do! When you learn how to do this every time, teach me.

Karl

Ps: Two years ago I was at a tournament warming up with a 1000+ rated golfer. He "pured" (per him) a full throw Buzzz. Then "threw pretty well" (also per him) a Force. The Force was about 8' further. This tells me that a "slower disc" thrown wonderfully is probably going to go as far as a "max dist disc" thrown average.

[Jeff Burrows]

Great wisdom, Karl. Makes a lot of sense.

Last summer/fall I was consistantly 350 and sometimes pushing 400 throwing BH with Surges. I had an injury, stopped throwing RH for a while, healed up, and now can't get any D. I can throw the Teebird on a line about 310 but can't throw anything faster/more stable than a Valkerie past that. Lost all of my snap and not sure why.
Hopefully will figure it out soon.
Anyone give lessons?

[Tom Fisher]

I have thrown the Opto line Halo, ESP Nuke and R-pro Boss pretty dang far. These are the optimal conditions i have found for each disc and how far i have thrown them.

Halo: slight tail wind with a swooping "s" will get this puppy far. Although i was driving a 5-10 mph headwind today and was putting a solid hyzer on it. it flew like a champ and landed almost on the line in front of me. it feels so good in my hand. and the plastic is unreal. pretty regularly this is flying around 380-420 ft.

Nuke: DO NOT THROW AN ESP NUKE INTO A HEADWIND UNLESS YOU WANT A ROLLER (WHICH THESE PUPPIES WILL ROLL FOREVER). i prefer a no wind setting for the nuke or a very slight tail. i have a hard time holding a hyzer with this. i always seem to crank it even the slightest bit over for a "?" looking drive. alot of glide. 400-430 ft

Boss: once again tail wind disc. I would like to try another variation of the boss to see if it holds better in a headwind. big s curve and the right wind i got this beast of a disc past the third park bench from the dirt path borderland. the second park bench is right at 435. so a far estimate would be 450 easy.

My head wind discs are still a star wraith and a champ firebird.

Wraith: about 310 with a head wind. 350 with a tail.

firebird: also about the same as the wraith. mine is pretty beat so it will hold an anhyzer for a small percent of the flight then come right back.

as far as what karl said about the mid ranges being able to crank i agree. crushin a wasp is something i love to do. slight tail or no wind i have got this to about 320. the extra glide is incredible. headwind mid range is and will always be my zone. if you dont have one i suggest you get one. overstable with a crap ton of glide. i have found my zone has began to get more glide the more it breaks in.


ALL OF MY DISTANCES I AM STATING HAVE BEEN WHEELED OFF WITH A WALKER

[Matt Aubin]

Tom, if the R-pro Boss is too flippy in the wind for you, try the Pro Boss, it's pretty nice.

[Keith Morin]

I was out throwing rocs in the soccer field near my house a few nights ago, once I got warmed up I could put all 4 straight out to about 290 feet, maybe a little farther if I gave them height and a little anny.
I couldn't seem to get my drivers (river, striker) out much past that same distance. Why would that be? Is it something to do with arm speed/snap ratio? Im confused.

[Mike Murphy]

I was out throwing rocs in the soccer field near my house a few nights ago, once I got warmed up I could put all 4 straight out to about 290 feet, maybe a little farther if I gave them height and a little anny.
I couldn't seem to get my drivers (river, striker) out much past that same distance. Why would that be? Is it something to do with arm speed/snap ratio? Im confused.

Probably has to do you with your short arms.

[Matt Aubin]

I was out throwing rocs in the soccer field near my house a few nights ago, once I got warmed up I could put all 4 straight out to about 290 feet, maybe a little farther if I gave them height and a little anny.
I couldn't seem to get my drivers (river, striker) out much past that same distance. Why would that be? Is it something to do with arm speed/snap ratio? Im confused.

You're 'strong arming' the throw, or not fully hitting and snapping at the very end. Most healthy guys with about 6 months of throwing under their belts can hit 275-300 with any disc, even some putters. The key to throwing drivers for distance is getting a 'full hit' and accelerating at the last 5% of the throw to generate speed and spin, without introducing off-axis torque.

There's about a zillion pages of info and videos on the subject over at Disc Golf Review. In a nutshell, if you've been playing for a while and can't seem to break 300-320 with a slow driver, start over. Re-learn to throw from the 'hit' backwards.

Watch this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4cjmbjq83M

pay close attention to the 'Bad... better... Snap" at the bottom of the screen. The first few throws look and sound good, UNTIL you see and hear the correct throws later on. Notice how the 'good' throws are very slow and controlled, almost no leg motion... the bad throws are faster and the acceleration starts too soon.

[Todd Lapham]

400-450ft golf line.

Z Nuke goes the farthest, although a beat Champ Boss was giving it a run for it's money the other day.

Destroyer is the most consistent.

All backhand with hyzer release, if I'm flicking I recommend taking cover.

I rarely throw anything faster than a Teebird, which I can get 375-400ft all day.

After watching Aubins video link, I realize I have no snap.

[Shawn Mullen]

350-400 golf D. I don't get over 400 very often. A lot of people throw farther than I do backhand. I still "only hit half of it".

What goes far for me right now. 1st run star destroyers, eco star valkyries. I have a nuke in the bag too, it'll go farther than the destroyer sometimes, and get there quicker, but it just isn't as consistent.

This is LHBH hyzer release. IMO if you can't throw the disc with a hyzer on it for a distance shot. You are throwing the wrong disc.

What flies farther than anything for me is the epic, tomahawk or thumber either way. Not sure exactly how far........but break out the range finder. I know I've cracked 500 with it. You drinkin the haterade?

[Shawn Mullen]

I was out throwing rocs in the soccer field near my house a few nights ago, once I got warmed up I could put all 4 straight out to about 290 feet, maybe a little farther if I gave them height and a little anny.
I couldn't seem to get my drivers (river, striker) out much past that same distance. Why would that be? Is it something to do with arm speed/snap ratio? Im confused.

You're 'strong arming' the throw, or not fully hitting and snapping at the very end. Most healthy guys with about 6 months of throwing under their belts can hit 275-300 with any disc, even some putters. The key to throwing drivers for distance is getting a 'full hit' and accelerating at the last 5% of the throw to generate speed and spin, without introducing off-axis torque.

There's about a zillion pages of info and videos on the subject over at Disc Golf Review. In a nutshell, if you've been playing for a while and can't seem to break 300-320 with a slow driver, start over. Re-learn to throw from the 'hit' backwards.

Watch this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4cjmbjq83M

pay close attention to the 'Bad... better... Snap" at the bottom of the screen. The first few throws look and sound good, UNTIL you see and hear the correct throws later on. Notice how the 'good' throws are very slow and controlled, almost no leg motion... the bad throws are faster and the acceleration starts too soon.

Prob has something to do with nose angle too.
That was my issue when just about everything flew the same distance.

[Keith Morin]

I tried the towel thing the other day, I just kept knocking stuff over and scaring my dog. I'll do it outside and see how that goes.

Yes, I have noticed a majority of my throws are nose up.

[Rob Underwood]

Max D:Stable to os Pro Destroyers(most glide in that plastic) and flat top e* wraiths(best mix of glide and grip). New this year is the star boss, when thrown flat in new condition this disc appears to be a true -1 HSS . All discs are 172g+ factory measured weight.
RHBH I've thrown wraiths and destroyers 450' flat ground field distance (droid complete distance app used to check) and the star boss is slightly shorter.

I've never really tried to throw distance lines (30'+ of height) or a 360 turnaround but if someone can offer advice id love to learn.

For max D with a middie id recommend barstamp buzzz. Seems to cruise toward 350+ with tailwind and space.

For speed 10+ discs I use a variation of the 4 finger power grip, anything slower gets the modified fan/power grip with the two middle fingers stacked on the pinky and pressed to the flight plate.I squeeze in with the fingers and the heel and ball(not tip) of the thumb.
I angle my runup to match the line I'm throwing(rhbh hyzer start slightly left and finish center or right). This helps avoid torquing the disc as it crosses your body.
I have been shooting rhbh for appx 15 months calender time but due to location I can't play from dec to march.

Hope this novel helps someone out! Breaking those distance plateaus can be tough.

[Isaac Chaney]

I throw the destroyer and the boss. I can throw 600ft on any given day if the wind isnt so bad. My crappy shots that have too much hyzer release still go about 550. In the right conditions I have thrown 700ish..i threw 592 at the usdgc in 2010, just missing the the cut at 595...lost all of my best drivers went in the water..had 5 brand new overstable destroyers that were just not working for me to reach the 700ft range...basically to achieve this distance with no effort iv spent alot of hours perfecting my power to snap ratio..and the way you move your body has a big play in it to..balance is key! It is very hard for me to teach distance..mainly because iv only met several people like avery j, gg, jeremy k who share the same power and techniques..its all on another level thats beyond most peoples capabilities. The only advice I could really think of is, reach back as far as you can, then pull through has hard as you can with your body, not your arm mucles..this will help create snap. And STAY balanced!! Also the more your throwing wrist is curled up the more snap you can generate. Once you gain more distance with some key fundamentals, you need to use some manual dexterity skills to to do little things here and there that can keep adding distance..it took me 3 years to go from 400ft, to a record 700ish..so be patient..and have an understanding that this isnt a race to out throw your best buds..its all about improving your overall skill level as a disc golfer.

[Steve Solbo]

400-450ft golf line.

Z Nuke goes the farthest, although a beat Champ Boss was giving it a run for it's money the other day.

Destroyer is the most consistent.

All backhand with hyzer release, if I'm flicking I recommend taking cover.

I rarely throw anything faster than a Teebird, which I can get 375-400ft all day.

After watching Aubins video link, I realize I have no snap.

second.

[Lucas Brewer]

well i have been playing for about a year and a half now.. dont really do tons of tournaments. ill be trying to sign up for the spring fling at borderland i usually just do the tournaments there and the vineyard social.

i have been throwing a star boss around 550ft as well as a champ katana... i also throw pro destroyers around 500-525ft .. longest drive would have to be around 600ft.

backhand btw

[Steve Solbo]

well i have been playing for about a year and a half now.. dont really do tons of tournaments. ill be trying to sign up for the spring fling at borderland i usually just do the tournaments there and the vineyard social.

i have been throwing a star boss around 550ft as well as a champ katana... i also throw pro destroyers around 500-525ft .. longest drive would have to be around 600ft.

backhand btw

1.5 years to get up to the 525-550 range. Impressive. I am hoping the wink is a show of sarcasm.

[Isaac Chaney]

Well he says hes going to the spring fling, guess we'll find out if its bs or not..ill certainly be backing my shiznit up

[Steve Solbo]

Well he says hes going to the spring fling, guess we'll find out if its bs or not..ill certainly be backing my shiznit up

yes we shall.

[Lucas Brewer]

Unfortunately I won't be making it to the spring fling got a wedding on the 11th to go to. But anyone who plays at riverhead knows my "D" and has seen me driving them into the parking lot

[Mark Valis]

Video Footage please

[Steve Solbo]

Unfortunately I won't be making it to the spring fling got a wedding on the 11th to go to. But anyone who plays at riverhead knows my "D" and has seen me driving them into the parking lot

I bet you don't throw further than Fabricio.

[Lucas Brewer]

Fab doesn't play much anymore. But we used to play often together about 8 months ago and we threw the same distance. Since then my form has improved and so has my distance.

[Steve Solbo]

Fab doesn't play much anymore. But we used to play often together about 8 months ago and we threw the same distance. Since then my form has improved and so has my distance.

He doesn't throw 600'. Never did, unless it was down hill, he probably taps out around 500'. Golf Distance too. Not talking bullcrap.

Your D puts you on par with world class distance, you realize this right? If you throw 550' golf distance, that's pretty much what guys like Jenkins, Feldberg and Co. are throwing...

Heck, if you're doing it on the Vineyard, you'd probably throw 800' at the Distance Competion at the Vibram. Would love to see it. This is surely, "Message Board D".

Issac is one of the furthest throwers out there. I've seen it in person.

[Lucas Brewer]

dont see why 500+ is so unbelievable...